Apple Pages and CMYK

I need to create a pdf with CMYK images (business cards) to send to a printer but Pages only seems to output RGB. I’m not familiar with Pages so am I missing something or do I need to find a workaround? I saw something about how a RGB pdf can be imported into Graphic Converter and output as CMYK.

Also, I just found this article from a few years ago but don’t know if it’s still relevant.

"If you’re running Tiger select File > Print and in the resulting sheet click the PDF button, choose Save PDF as PostScript command, and click the Print button.

Now that you have a PostScript file, open it in Preview, where it will be converted to a PDF file. Once there, chose File > Save As and save the file. Although this may seem like you’re unnecessarily going over the same ground twice, saving the file as a PostScript document and then converting it to a PDF within Preview makes the file behave properly in Acrobat."

Insight appreciated.

Thanks,

Todd

I don’t think it’s possible. I don’t use Pages 08 although I own it (I use InDesign and illustrator 90 percent of the time) but I looked through it just now and I don’t see that you can set a Pages document to use CMYK colors at all.


offtopic mailing list
email@hidden
Update your subscriptions at:
http://freewaytalk.net/person/options

On 28 Sep 2008, at 20:50, Todd wrote:

I need to create a pdf with CMYK images (business cards) to send to
a printer but Pages only seems to output RGB.

Any printer worth their salt these days will simply shrug and take
your file without comment. If they’ve got a proper colour workflow set
up, it matters not one whit whether the files they receive are RGB or
CMYK. It should all be sorted out by their RIP.

;o)

Heather


“Freeway - Web Design for All”


offtopic mailing list
email@hidden
Update your subscriptions at:
http://freewaytalk.net/person/options

Pages will use whatever colour space you use. The default colours and colour picker are RGB
If you show the colour palette and pick the sliders option (2nd from left at the top of the window) tiy can then pick CMYK sliders, Pages will now output anything that you set with this palette as CMYK. Any object whose colour was set with the RGB controls will output in RGB.


offtopic mailing list
email@hidden
Update your subscriptions at:
http://freewaytalk.net/person/options

On 28 Sep 2008, at 20:50, Todd wrote:

I need to create a pdf with CMYK images (business cards) to send to
a printer but Pages only seems to output RGB.

Todd, to the best of my knowledge, the PDF workflow will iron out any
wrinkles. You can use RGB throughout in Pages and, when you export a
PDF for the printer, he will be able to use it without problems as
CMYK conversions will occur on the fly when it’s printed.

best wishes,

Paul Bradforth

http://www.paulbradforth.com


offtopic mailing list
email@hidden
Update your subscriptions at:
http://freewaytalk.net/person/options

On 29 Sep 2008, at 09:46, Paul Bradforth wrote:

he will be able to use it without problems as CMYK conversions will
occur on the fly when it’s printed

Of course, the only caveat being that “loud” RGB colours will be muted
by the conversion to the very much smaller colour space of CMYK.

Heather


“Freeway - Web Design for All”


offtopic mailing list
email@hidden
Update your subscriptions at:
http://freewaytalk.net/person/options

Thanks Everyone.

Heather, if it’s not that critical then I won’t worry about it. My question stemmed from posts on the Apple forum regarding Pages inability to produce a color-separated pdf. I also found this article that suggests a workaround, <http://i-work-in-pages.blogspot.com/2007/11/pages-and-professional-printshops-why.html> for creating a 4 color separation pdf from a Pages file using Acrobat Distiller.

I don’t have Acrobat and this is probably more than I need to do for a simple business card but I was (still am, actually) scratching my head trying to make sense of it all.

Thanks,

Todd

On Sep 29, 2008, at 2:40 AM, Heather Kavanagh wrote:

Any printer worth their salt these days will simply shrug and take your file without comment. If they’ve got a proper colour workflow set up, it matters not one whit whether the files they receive are RGB or CMYK. It should all be sorted out by their RIP.

Of course, the only caveat being that “loud” RGB colours will be muted
by the conversion to the very much smaller colour space of CMYK.

As long as true color accuracy is not important as Heather implies, then a modern print service can print anything as has been pointed out.


offtopic mailing list
email@hidden
Update your subscriptions at:
http://freewaytalk.net/person/options

On 29 Sep 2008, at 16:16, Todd wrote:

I don’t have Acrobat and this is probably more than I need to do for
a simple business card but I was (still am, actually) scratching my
head trying to make sense of it all.

I’d be surprised if a good printer would expect separations at all. If
you submit a PDF, they will do whatever they do to output the file to
whatever they use to create the print.

In other words, don’t worry about it. Just send them the PDF. If in
doubt, ask them what they prefer.

In my case, when we send PDFs to our outside litho bods, we just send
them the high res PDF (from InDesign, so we include the crop and
registration marks). They do the magic from that. I’ve only had one
request for separations in the last five years, and that was last week!

Hope that helps.

Heather


“Freeway - Web Design for All”


offtopic mailing list
email@hidden
Update your subscriptions at:
http://freewaytalk.net/person/options

That does help, thanks. Regarding your previous post about sending the pdf as RGB or CMYK not mattering, I was under the impression that anything going to a professional printer needed to be in CMYK otherwise there would be unwanted color shifts from what’s seen in the working file as compared to final printed version.

Todd

On Sep 29, 2008, at 11:00 AM, Heather Kavanagh wrote:

I’d be surprised if a good printer would expect separations at all. If you submit a PDF, they will do whatever they do to output the file to whatever they use to create the print.

In other words, don’t worry about it. Just send them the PDF. If in doubt, ask them what they prefer.

In my case, when we send PDFs to our outside litho bods, we just send them the high res PDF (from InDesign, so we include the crop and registration marks). They do the magic from that. I’ve only had one request for separations in the last five years, and that was last week!

Hope that helps.

I was under the impression that anything going to a professional
printer needed to be in CMYK otherwise there would be unwanted color
shifts

That’s quite possible, but if you convert to CMYK using unsuitable
settings then you ‘freeze’ the artwork in a form that could
disappoint anyway. Talk to the printer, see what they recommend.

k


offtopic mailing list
email@hidden
Update your subscriptions at:
http://freewaytalk.net/person/options

Yes you can send RGB files that can be easily converted to CMYK, but
you can and will get nasty sunrises, some RGB dark blues can turn more
of a purple blue when printed. Greens shift massively duller - and
light blues.

Also what you think is a simple RGB black will convert and be made up
out of 4 process colours, that will print a little blurry and a very
dark browny black, and overload the paper full of ink, rather than a
crisp edge single black.

(email it direct to me and I can take a look at it for you)

David

So If possible to prevent surprises, try and work in CMYK.

On 29 Sep 2008, at 17:18, Todd wrote:

I was under the impression that anything going to a professional
printer needed to be in CMYK otherwise there would be unwanted color
shifts from what’s seen in the working file as compared to final
printed version.

David Owen
http://www.ineedwebhosting.co.uk
http://www.printlineadvertising.co.uk/print.html


offtopic mailing list
email@hidden
Update your subscriptions at:
http://freewaytalk.net/person/options

Sometime around 29/9/08 (at 18:58 +0100) David Owen said:

Also what you think is a simple RGB black will convert and be made
up out of 4 process colours, that will print a little blurry and a
very dark browny black, and overload the paper full of ink, rather
than a crisp edge single black.

Well, only if the conversion process is set up poorly! Converting RGB
black to a decent CMYK black is far from impossible, but it is best
done with knowledge of the press details.

There can be issues with other colours, but in the end it comes down
to using the right process to convert to CMYK. Although CMYK can’t
reproduce the richer ends of RGB, it can be used to produce rich and
vibrant colour.

Some people now do use an all-RGB workflow, leaving the conversion
process to the very end, in the RIP. This requires a very
well-managed colour workflow and good profiles. But without this kind
of control and management it can be as risky as you say.

k


offtopic mailing list
email@hidden
Update your subscriptions at:
http://freewaytalk.net/person/options

Any printer worth your time will work with you on getting the job done right. If you have a good color printer that prints the colors the way you’re expecting them, you should be able to bring that to them so they can see and compare to make sure you get what you want. Ideally, they’ll print a proof for your approval first, but for certain kinds of jobs that probably doesn’t happen. I could be wrong though.

I guess what I’m saying is that communication is key. If they know what you need they should want to do that for you and make you a happy customer.


offtopic mailing list
email@hidden
Update your subscriptions at:
http://freewaytalk.net/person/options

What will probably end up happening is that the client (located
elsewhere) will take the file to his own - as yet undetermined -
printer, so any adjustments that may be required I will have to deal
with long distance. You’re all correct in that communication is the
key but I suppose until I know who I’ll be dealing with (the printer)
it’s all a bit up in the air.

Thanks,

Todd

On Sep 29, 2008, at 1:58 PM, Joe Muscara wrote:

Any printer worth your time will work with you on getting the job
done right. If you have a good color printer that prints the colors
the way you’re expecting them, you should be able to bring that to
them so they can see and compare to make sure you get what you
want. Ideally, they’ll print a proof for your approval first, but
for certain kinds of jobs that probably doesn’t happen. I could be
wrong though.

I guess what I’m saying is that communication is key. If they know
what you need they should want to do that for you and make you a
happy customer.


offtopic mailing list
email@hidden
Update your subscriptions at:
http://freewaytalk.net/person/options

This is fine for RGB bitmap images in a document, not RGB text. We’re
quite happy with an RGB Images workflow here, where the problems start
is when client put text in RGB, this cannot really be picked through
to correct, and the problems I noted start to appear.

David

On 29 Sep 2008, at 19:57, Keith Martin wrote:

Well, only if the conversion process is set up poorly! Converting
RGB black to a decent CMYK black is far from impossible, but it is
best done with knowledge of the press details.

There can be issues with other colours, but in the end it comes down
to using the right process to convert to CMYK. Although CMYK can’t
reproduce the richer ends of RGB, it can be used to produce rich and
vibrant colour.

Some people now do use an all-RGB workflow, leaving the conversion
process to the very end, in the RIP. This requires a very well-
managed colour workflow and good profiles. But without this kind of
control and management it can be as risky as you say.


offtopic mailing list
email@hidden
Update your subscriptions at:
http://freewaytalk.net/person/options

Sometime around 30/9/08 (at 08:30 +0100) David Owen said:

This is fine for RGB bitmap images in a document, not RGB text.

Sure, I just wanted to point out that RGB black is not inherently
disasterous and RGB layouts can work very well! :slight_smile: It is really
small text and similar fine line details in black (or reversed out of
black) where multi-ink rich-black problems really kick off.

Basically, what we’re both pointing towards is the fact that the
appropriate level of colour control and therefore the ability to use
a pro-level RGB workflow is difficult to achieve in non-pro apps.
Apple’s Pages is very good as a quick ‘n’ easy page design tool, but
it isn’t really meant as a replacement for InDesign or QuarkXPress.

k


offtopic mailing list
email@hidden
Update your subscriptions at:
http://freewaytalk.net/person/options