Master Settings / Content???

I just laid out a new Master page for a site using CSS only and notice not one element presents the “Use Master Settings” or “Use Master Content” check boxes in the inspector.

I went back and looked at several other sites and see that some elements include these options, while others don’t.

I am willing to bet that there is some rhyme and reason for this, but without spending many hours experimenting to determine why, I am at a loss.

Can someone here explain why some workflows/layouts allow elements in pages the ability to reset master content and settings while others do not?


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On 16 Aug 2008, at 03:22, Solutions Etcetera wrote:

Can someone here explain why some workflows/layouts allow elements
in pages the ability to reset master content and settings while
others do not?

Sorry I haven’t answered your question; I suspect someone else will do
that better than me. I just wanted to be pedantic for the sake of
folks new to Freeway, just in case, and say that the sentence above
could be confusing to people who don’t know their way around yet.

Elements in pages don’t have the “ability to reset master content and
settings”, it’s the other way round: you can get Master content to
alter what’s on the page, but not vice versa. It would have been
better if your sentence had read: “allow elements in pages the ability
to BE reset BY master content and settings”. Sorry to be fussy.

best wishes,

Paul Bradforth

http://www.paulbradforth.com


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Dear Solutions Etcetera

Are you using inline items? When you insert an inline item on a Master
Page, it appears on the site pages but there are no Master Page
controls.

On 16 Aug 2008, at 03:22, Solutions Etcetera wrote:

Can someone here explain why some workflows/layouts allow elements
in pages the ability to reset master content and settings while
others do not?


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Thanks Graham… that appears to be exactly the issue . Never thought I’d want to see the component structure of DW and GL again but now I long for it.

Perhaps the Powers That Be can explain the thinking behind this. Clearly inline items are still objects in the FW page metaphor, why can they no longer be associated with master content and settings once any parent is edited?

This makes any inline layout in FW tedious at best as any change in a nav menus or links have to be applied to every page the master is based.


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Welcome to my world! After spending days/weeks creating my web site I found out the hard way too. All updates that I planned via the ONE master page now has to be done by hand to ALL pages that will require the link/change and that could be as many as 60+

Too late now to go back. FW is not the time saver I originally thought!

I had hoped someone would write an action to fix this glaring and frustrating omission from what is touted as a huge feature of the app.


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ok… here is a weird situation… I have been looking at changing my
business name from gr designs to garden fresh marketing due to a high
number of gr designs when googled.

I had a friend google my company (gr designs) and I came up second…
but when I google gr designs I come up iin the 4th or 5th page.

does anyone have an explanation of this and how can i correct this…

thanks in advance…
Jules
On Aug 26, 2008, at 2:21 PM, Lee Foster wrote:

Welcome to my world! After spending days/weeks creating my web site
I found out the hard way too. All updates that I planned via the ONE
master page now has to be done by hand to ALL pages that will
require the link/change and that could be as many as 60+

Too late now to go back. FW is not the time saver I originally
thought!

I had hoped someone would write an action to fix this glaring and
frustrating omission from what is touted as a huge feature of the app.


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Sometime around 26/8/08 (at 15:48 -0400) julie maxwell allen said:

I had a friend google my company (gr designs) and I came up second…
but when I google gr designs I come up iin the 4th or 5th page.

Precise results in Google depend on which Google server your search
goes through. This can change by time, and pretty much anything else
you can imagine, and as far as I know there’s no way to make the
choice yourself.

The differences are generally not large, and they’re due mainly to
Google’s constant, massive index updating work. Location can make a
bigger difference, but your issue may be something that changes
(hopefully for the better) as the various servers get caught up.

k


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To get back onto the original thread about Master Settings / Content???

I also feel slightly let down that inline css on a master page doesn’t work the way I thought it would.

After creating various inline css layouts on master pages, making sure they work in all browsers and taking a lot less time to construct than they would coding them by hand (thank you Softpress for giving us a simple way to construct css layouts in a visual manner), I was more than a little disappointed that making even a small change to an inline item on the master page didn’t affect the pages created from it.

It would be a fantastic addition, whether built-in to FW itself or as an action (which I would gladly pay for), to have the ability to flag any type of inline item on a master page as being constant (page header, company logo etc) or updatable on individual pages (body text area, sidebar, graphic placeholder etc).

This would just make FW life so much easier.

C


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sorry about that craig

julie
On Aug 26, 2008, at 4:47 PM, Craig Paterson wrote:

To get back onto the original thread about Master Settings /
Content???

I also feel slightly let down that inline css on a master page
doesn’t work the way I thought it would.

After creating various inline css layouts on master pages, making
sure they work in all browsers and taking a lot less time to
construct than they would coding them by hand (thank you Softpress
for giving us a simple way to construct css layouts in a visual
manner), I was more than a little disappointed that making even a
small change to an inline item on the master page didn’t affect the
pages created from it.

It would be a fantastic addition, whether built-in to FW itself or
as an action (which I would gladly pay for), to have the ability to
flag any type of inline item on a master page as being constant
(page header, company logo etc) or updatable on individual pages
(body text area, sidebar, graphic placeholder etc).

This would just make FW life so much easier.

C


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It would be a fantastic addition, whether built-in to FW itself or as an action (which I would gladly pay for), to have the ability to flag any type of inline item on a master page as being constant (page header, company logo etc) or updatable on individual pages (body text area, sidebar, graphic placeholder etc).

This would just make FW life so much easier.

I hope one of the SP brass is reading this


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Or even an action writer. I’d pay for this functionality. I wrote my request in the Actions Dev section and how it would work in a user friendly way. (Please someone, take up the gauntlet or someone in SP reveal it’s getting worked on)


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Sorry Julie, didn’t mean to sound so harsh :frowning:

C


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Don’t worry you didn’t - I interrupted and that was rude and normally
not me.

J:)
On Aug 27, 2008, at 2:46 AM, Craig Paterson wrote:

Sorry Julie, didn’t mean to sound so harsh :frowning:

C


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Ok C and J… get a room. (c;

I think that before submitting feature requests it would be nice if someone from SP would weigh in here as to whether this is indeed expected behavior. AFAIAC, its a bug.

While I “guess” I can see some sort of logic in an inline object that detaches from a master when its parent is edited, I see no reason why anyone would want this kind of behavior. IMHO, if FW sees it as an object that was created via a master page, that object should not be detached from a master unless “it” has been edited from a slaved page (and its content and settings should be resettable).

Now there may be some (less than obvious) technical reason as to why FW behaves this way, or it may just be an oversite. I am hoping for the latter.


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Sometime around 27/8/08 (at 08:57 -0400) Solutions Etcetera said:

Ok C and JŠ get a room. (c;

I think that before submitting feature requests
it would be nice if someone from SP would weigh
in here as to whether this is indeed expected
behavior.

No idea about the definitive technical or
official answer, but it is clear that there’s a
difference between page-level objects and inline
objects.

Things work pretty well for non-inline layouts,
where people put stuff on the page in a regular
DTP manner. It is when we move into the newer
world of inline CSS content in Freeway that
master page behaviour comes up short.

My guess is that it is something that requires
rethinking how objects are handled in some way. I
doubt very much whether this is intended or even
tacitly accepted behaviour, and I too am hoping
that this is something that will be improved.

(Actually, I’m hoping that inline layout
behaviour can be improved across the board. I
find it a somewhat frustrating process.)

k


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On 27 Aug 2008, 1:26 pm, thatkeith wrote:

It is when we move into the newer
world of inline CSS content in Freeway that
master page behaviour comes up short.

Note that it is not just inline CSS divs, but any inline objects, so this is hardly a “new” world.


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Sometime around 27/8/08 (at 10:04 -0400) Solutions Etcetera said:

Note that it is not just inline CSS divs, but any inline objects, so
this is hardly a “new” world.

True, good point. I stand corrected. :slight_smile:

In which case this may be something to do with the way text is
handled, as ‘in-flow’ inline content seems to be on a par with text.

Whether or not there’s an official statement about this, I think
feature requests are in order. We shouldn’t have to wait for
pronouncements just to feed back what we’d like.

Erm… could someone perhaps write up exactly what is wanted? I could
do it I guess, but I actually don’t try using inline content on
master pages - partly because it hasn’t worked so well!

k


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Well… I was hoping for some input as to why it is currently the way it is before attempting to redefine the behavior, but here’s a shot. I don’t think it is complicated behavior (at least not from an end user standpoint).

If you look at your master in the sidebar (page view) you’ll see a list of objects. All of these objects should maintain master content and settings on all slave pages unless the actual item on a particular slave page is edited.

The edited slave page’s item should be able to restore the master content and settings like non-inline objects via two checkboxes in the inspector.

Granted the above is an ideal scenario, and if there are programmatical reasons why this isn’t feasible there could be others. I have no idea how discrete FW’s object model is, but it “seems” to have all the information it needs to reference an inline object the same way as any other.

-ss


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As a bit of a workaround for this, I’ve been using includes, using the “PHP make insert page” action. Moving any frequently used inline content to its own Freeway 5 (includes) page.

By using the new FW5 feature on clicking on a blank page, and adding formatted content directly onto the FW5 page (no divs) just the inline text/picture content). These pages are put in a Freeway site folder called includes, which I can edit to update a 60 page site for instance.

Because of mainly producing inline pages, I don’t use master pages anymore, Preferring to copy and paste whole pages.

It does leave some kind of inline items, in a framework of divs with markup (because Freeway can’t see its changed), that could be changed on a master page, and would influence the rest of the site. But its not very Freeway like.

On 27 Aug 2008, at 15:13, Keith Martin wrote:

but I actually don’t try using inline content on

master pages - partly because it hasn’t worked so well!

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Here’s my preference I wrote in another section based on an idea for a master sync action:

Select the areas of the page you want to keep synced (eg, in-line div),

• add the action,

• the palette would ask, “Sync with what?”

• you choose on the pop up menu which master to sync to (probably the one from which the page was created or even the section of another one)

• a secondary pop up then asks for which part (eg, in-line div on master (in my case it would be the links menu)).

• From now on all changes made in the master page box would be reflected on any page or section in the site that had the action applied.

There is already a ‘Use Master Content’ option but it doesn’t apply to in-line divs so technically the capability is there, it just needs expanding.

Obviously this would apply to sites like mine that are finished but if this was built in at the beginning it wouldn’t be such a nightmare to implement.


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