I know this was discussed some years ago, but I’m curious to know what most people are using for page width these days.
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Universally 960px is the absolute standard for fixed width web design at
the moment. Those who deviate either do so to be different or because they
know no better - but what they differ from is 960px. Smaller looks
laughable on a a large monitor - bigger and you run the risk of the dreaded
sideways scroll.
On 26 April 2013 16:14, RavenManiac email@hidden wrote:
I know this was discussed some years ago, but I’m curious to know what
most people are using for page width these days.
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That’s what I’ve always been taught as well.
But how does the 960 Grid System factor into this? If I use the 960 Grid my page margins end up being only 10 pixels wide, which looks awkward—especially since the 960 Grid System uses 20 pixel spacing between columns.
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I also noticed that Apple is using 980 pixels.
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Yes, 960 is a good reference and is considered optimal. And while it’s good to be aware of going too narrow or too wide don’t get hung up on the numbers, use what works for the design and content. Just because 'everyone" is using it doesn’t mean you have to.
Todd
I also noticed that Apple is using 980 pixels.
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True, but the 960 Grid makes it a lot easier to divide pages, which is why I like it. I just don’t like the margins. If I could get around that problem I’d be golden.
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I made my own grid system in freeway - just a template with a lot of styled
boxes for easy copy and paste - speed things up no end.
Thing is, to be honest, I dont know anybody who actually still uses a
1024px monitor do you?
On 26 April 2013 17:16, RavenManiac email@hidden wrote:
True, but the 960 Grid makes it a lot easier to divide pages, which is why
I like it. I just don’t like the margins. If I could get around that
problem I’d be golden.
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I don’t.
The nice thing about the 960 Grid System is it’s divisible by 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 8, 10, 12, 15, 16, 20, 24, 30, 32, 40, 48, 60, 64, 80, 96, 120, 160, 192, 240, 320 and 480, which makes it highly adaptable.
Would enlarging my page size to 980 really break a lot of mobile devices?
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No, most mobiles and tablets scale the page to fit the page to the screen
- but your text will be small and hard to read - its 1024 monitors (as a
lowest common denominator) that you’re designing for at 960px because they
wont scale.
I dont see the point of responsive design - its messy - not when you can
just design another mobile site. IMHO its a fad
On 26 April 2013 17:28, RavenManiac email@hidden wrote:
I don’t.
The nice thing about the 960 Grid System is it’s divisible by 2, 3, 4, 5,
6, 8, 10, 12, 15, 16, 20, 24, 30, 32, 40, 48, 60, 64, 80, 96, 120, 160,
192, 240, 320 and 480, which makes it highly adaptable.Would enlarging my page size to 980 really break a lot of mobile devices?
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BTW dont forget that its only become 960 to allow for a slight visible
margin and Windows fugly scroll bar on a 1024px - and because it divides
nicely as a number - thats all
On 26 April 2013 17:32, Glyn Winter email@hidden wrote:
No, most mobiles and tablets scale the page to fit the page to the screen
- but your text will be small and hard to read - its 1024 monitors (as a
lowest common denominator) that you’re designing for at 960px because they
wont scale.I dont see the point of responsive design - its messy - not when you can
just design another mobile site. IMHO its a fadOn 26 April 2013 17:28, RavenManiac email@hidden wrote:
I don’t.
The nice thing about the 960 Grid System is it’s divisible by 2, 3, 4, 5,
6, 8, 10, 12, 15, 16, 20, 24, 30, 32, 40, 48, 60, 64, 80, 96, 120, 160,
192, 240, 320 and 480, which makes it highly adaptable.Would enlarging my page size to 980 really break a lot of mobile devices?
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Glynster, since you seem to have a lot more experience than I do, may I ask what type of grid system you use?
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I use the www.960.gs system if coding by hand as it makes hand coding a
doddle. When using FW I approximate the same thing though I rarely do
anything that occupies a box smaller than 1/4 of the page so its not rocket
science for me to work out as I go.
On 26 April 2013 17:36, RavenManiac email@hidden wrote:
Glynster, since you seem to have a lot more experience than I do, may I
ask what type of grid system you use?
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BTW if you scroll do the page at www.960.gs a little until you see the
featured sites you can toggle on and off the grid using the button above
each site to see how the sites adhere to the grid.
On 26 April 2013 17:41, Glyn Winter email@hidden wrote:
I use the www.960.gs system if coding by hand as it makes hand coding a
doddle. When using FW I approximate the same thing though I rarely do
anything that occupies a box smaller than 1/4 of the page so its not rocket
science for me to work out as I go.On 26 April 2013 17:36, RavenManiac email@hidden wrote:
Glynster, since you seem to have a lot more experience than I do, may I
ask what type of grid system you use?
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What about page margins? My preference is 20 pixels on the left and right, which is what’s screwing me up with the 960 Grid System.
If I change my margins to 20 pixels, that leaves me with 920 pixels of usable space. If you design a 3 column layout with 20 pixels between them you end up with columns that are 293.33333 pixels wide or 4 columns that are 215 pixels wide, which is better.
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On 26 Apr 2013, 4:44 pm, Glynster wrote:
BTW if you scroll do the page at www.960.gs a little until you see the
featured sites you can toggle on and off the grid using the button above
each site to see how the sites adhere to the grid.
I saw that, but most of the demo pages look like they have margins that are 30 pixels wide. I’m assuming that’s because they’re showing the page in a 1024 pixel browser, which leaves 32 pixels per side. The problem is if you use a page background color or image, it’ll reveal that you only have a 10 pixel margin per side, which looks awkward.
Perhaps I’m putting too much thought into this. 
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Yeah but dont forget, providing your page is centered layout, your margin
is effectively infinite and as wide as the users browser so 10px is plenty
to the edge of your grid - the vast majority of people will see more where
the bg colour is the same as your page colour. However, there’s nothing
stopping you redoing your calculations or going for a 980 even as it wont
cause sideways scroll on 1024. But yeah, a centered page will stay centred
until the left margin hits the left of the browser - then it effectively
acts like left justified.
On 26 April 2013 17:50, RavenManiac email@hidden wrote:
What about page margins? My preference is 20 pixels on the left and right,
which is what’s screwing me up with the 960 Grid System.If I change my margins to 20 pixels, that leaves me with 920 pixels of
usable space. If you design a 3 column layout with 20 pixels between them
you end up with columns that are 293.33333 pixels wide or 4 columns that
are 215 pixels wide, which is better.
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BTW why not make left and right margins 19px? Visually it will look the
same and be like this with 3 columns…
19 | 294 | 20 | 294 | 20 | 294 | 19
On 26 April 2013 18:01, Glyn Winter email@hidden wrote:
Yeah but dont forget, providing your page is centered layout, your margin
is effectively infinite and as wide as the users browser so 10px is plenty
to the edge of your grid - the vast majority of people will see more where
the bg colour is the same as your page colour. However, there’s nothing
stopping you redoing your calculations or going for a 980 even as it wont
cause sideways scroll on 1024. But yeah, a centered page will stay centred
until the left margin hits the left of the browser - then it effectively
acts like left justified.On 26 April 2013 17:50, RavenManiac email@hidden wrote:
What about page margins? My preference is 20 pixels on the left and
right, which is what’s screwing me up with the 960 Grid System.If I change my margins to 20 pixels, that leaves me with 920 pixels of
usable space. If you design a 3 column layout with 20 pixels between them
you end up with columns that are 293.33333 pixels wide or 4 columns that
are 215 pixels wide, which is better.
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BTW, not meaning to state the obvious but: you do know FW will calculate
all your guide widths for you based on the space left over after you set
your margins and gutter by using the PAGE>CREATE GUIDES command? Just first
set your margins as you want them before you run the wizard and then tick
the “from margins” box
On 26 April 2013 18:08, Glyn Winter email@hidden wrote:
BTW why not make left and right margins 19px? Visually it will look the
same and be like this with 3 columns…19 | 294 | 20 | 294 | 20 | 294 | 19
On 26 April 2013 18:01, Glyn Winter email@hidden wrote:
Yeah but dont forget, providing your page is centered layout, your margin
is effectively infinite and as wide as the users browser so 10px is plenty
to the edge of your grid - the vast majority of people will see more where
the bg colour is the same as your page colour. However, there’s nothing
stopping you redoing your calculations or going for a 980 even as it wont
cause sideways scroll on 1024. But yeah, a centered page will stay centred
until the left margin hits the left of the browser - then it effectively
acts like left justified.On 26 April 2013 17:50, RavenManiac email@hidden wrote:
What about page margins? My preference is 20 pixels on the left and
right, which is what’s screwing me up with the 960 Grid System.If I change my margins to 20 pixels, that leaves me with 920 pixels of
usable space. If you design a 3 column layout with 20 pixels between them
you end up with columns that are 293.33333 pixels wide or 4 columns that
are 215 pixels wide, which is better.
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On 26 Apr 2013, 5:20 pm, Glynster wrote:
BTW, not meaning to state the obvious but: you do know FW will calculate
all your guide widths for you based on the space left over after you set
your margins and gutter by using the PAGE>CREATE GUIDES command? Just first
set your margins as you want them before you run the wizard and then tick
the “from margins” box
Yes, I know. I just like even numbers.
I may try the 980 page size with the 960 Grid System. I know Thomas Kimmich uses that and it seems to work for him.
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Whoa! Glynn hold on, you say responsive design is a Fad? You’re suggest maintaining two sites and content, twice the work as a better option? What if you’re adding a client run CMS which site gets the content?
And pinching to zoom tiny text a better option on tablets?
–
David Owen
On 26 Apr 2013, at 17:32, Glyn Winter email@hidden wrote:
I dont see the point of responsive design - its messy - not when you can
just design another mobile site. IMHO its a fad
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