setting the grid

Can someone please explain to me how to set up the grid in Intaglio,
as I’ve always found the settings
to be something of a ‘black art’. I’m trying to work out how I can get
30 equal spacings for A3 paper.
(A3 is 420.5mm x 297mm)

Also, how on earth does one use the dimension tool? I also always get
wrong readings.

I’ve tried for years to get my head round these, even from the manual,
but to no avail.

Anyone?


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30 even spacings across or down? 420.5 divided by 30 is an irrational number, so it’s not likely you’ll get 30 even spacings across without one being slightly off. But, it really depends on what you’re trying to do.


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30 even spacings across or down? 420.5 divided by 30 is an
irrational number, so it’s not likely you’ll get 30 even spacings
across without one being slightly off.

Exactly!

So, how should one set up the grid then?

The number isn’t irrational, it’s just that Intaglio rejects it.

14.01666666667 to be precise. I chose this number because I counted
the existing
number of squares in the grid- which was roughly 30 already

In a CAD program, you wouldn’t have this problem normally. (I’m
talking AutoCAD btw)

So again, my question is; how does one set up the grid for an equal
amount of spaces?
(FWIW, I’ve been an Intaglio user for about 5 or 6 years, and this
still foxes me. It’s the power
of apple-shift-4 you know, Quartz realtime resizing and being able to
export GIF’s from
Photoshop you know! :wink: :¬) )

But, it really depends on what you’re trying to do.

Ooh I hate questions like this! lol! That’s a very specific question.
What am I trying to do?
Well, create an A3 layout, which I must say I’ve done countless times
before without
setting the grid- but this time I want to use the dimension tool,
which imho, is about
as cryptic as the grid, and they need each other.

I’ve tried inputting the dimensions of x and y to meet A3, yet the
dimension tool gives
a very incorrect reading.

So, what gives?

Question again, just to be sure; “I want to set the grid for equal
spacing on (UK, not USA) A3 (or A4)
so that the Dimensioning tool also works correctly”

regards,

Tom

On 14 May 2008, at 08:14, KeynoteKen wrote:


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I’m sorry, the number isn’t irrational, I am :slight_smile: I meant that it’s a repeating decimal in that even what you’ve got up there multiplied by 30 doesn’t equal 420.5, it’s 420.5-a bunch of zeroes-1. The rounding of many systems will give you 420.5 regardless of if you multiply 30 times 14.01666666667 or 14.01666666665 or 14.01666666662…

I changed the dimensioning to pixels and 26.87 is probably the closest I can get to 30 even spaces (it’s actually 26.866666~ but visually 26.87 looks good).

I’m curious as to what the “accepted” way of dealing with repeating decimals are in an application like AutoCAD though. After a certain level of precision, round off? (That’s what Intaglio seems to do, but at two decimal places instead of 8 or 9)


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(A3 is 420.5mm x 297mm)

First time I’d heard that - the ISO 216 standard uses integer mm
measurements. These have been calculated by progressively rounding
down any non-integer result, which thereby guarantees that two A(n+1)
pages together are never larger than an An page.

The sizes are defined as follows:

A0 841 × 1189
A1 594 × 841
A2 420 × 594
A3 297 × 420
A4 210 × 297
A5 148 × 210
A6 105 × 148
And so on.

Therefore, the question of dividing an A3 sheet into 30 equal columns
becomes trivial: 420/30 = 14mm.

Phil.


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Seems a lot more simple now :slight_smile: I never even thought to look up the actual A3 sizes.

http://www.graytex.com/measurements-of-a3-paper.htm


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Hi Phil

On 14 May 2008, at 14:32, Phil Hendry wrote:

(A3 is 420.5mm x 297mm)

First time I’d heard that -

Wikipedia;

Open up the SVG webpage link to the right, and the measurement is 841mm,
half of which is 420.5mm :¬)

I set this size anyway in custom paper sizes under page setup, and it
works every
time at the printers :¬)

But I am (Wikipedia is) wrong? Are you sure these above are right?

BTW, annoyingly the V3 beta just crashed- where do I file the crash
reports?


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You’ll see that 841mm includes the “dead page” in the upper left which isn’t given a measurement. On the right side of the page, the A2 (which is as wide as the A3) is given an explicit measurement of 420 mm. Where’d the extra millimeter go, I don’t know! :slight_smile:

Also, in the chart lower on that Wiki page, they give the size of A3 as 297 x 420.


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On 14 May 2008, at 16:10, KeynoteKen wrote:

You’ll see that 841mm includes the “dead page” in the upper left
which isn’t given a measurement. On the right side of the page, the
A2 (which is as wide as the A3) is given an explicit measurement of
420 mm. Where’d the extra millimeter go, I don’t know! :slight_smile:

Once you divide 841 by two, you do indeed, get 420.5, BUT, under the
ISO 216 standard, you then round down to the nearest integer number

  • 420 in this case.

Phil


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Cheers Phil.

Makes some more sense now

420 divide by 30 = 14

A much more manageable number.

Tell me, does anyone use Omni Graffle at all? I’ve just been playing
with v5, and the text tools are a lot better than Intaglio’s.

On 14 May 2008, at 16:45, Phil Hendry wrote:

On 14 May 2008, at 16:10, KeynoteKen wrote:

You’ll see that 841mm includes the “dead page” in the upper left
which isn’t given a measurement. On the right side of the page, the
A2 (which is as wide as the A3) is given an explicit measurement of
420 mm. Where’d the extra millimeter go, I don’t know! :slight_smile:

Once you divide 841 by two, you do indeed, get 420.5, BUT, under the
ISO 216 standard, you then round down to the nearest integer number

  • 420 in this case.

Phil


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But I am (Wikipedia is) wrong?

No - where you’ve gone wrong is to divide 841 by two and then fail
to round the resulting number down to the nearest integer. The
numbers on the page all look correct to me. But the ISO standard
specifies integers (whole numbers), so you can’t just take the value
of 841 and divide by two.

Are you sure these above are right?

Absolutely.

Phil


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So generally it is a rule of thumb to ‘round down’ rather
than ‘round up’?

It’s funny because in engineering, it would be better to go up
rather than down.

On 14 May 2008, at 16:51, Phil Hendry wrote:

But I am (Wikipedia is) wrong?

No - where you’ve gone wrong is to divide 841 by two and then fail
to round the resulting number down to the nearest integer. The
numbers on the page all look correct to me. But the ISO standard
specifies integers (whole numbers), so you can’t just take the value
of 841 and divide by two.

Are you sure these above are right?

Absolutely.

Phil


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It appears to be that way for these “A” sizes under ISO 216 (a very special case indeed!). I never looked into them before today and it’s interesting how they came about.


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