ECM

Has anyone used any of the ECM listed here http://www.cmscritic.com/dir/enterprise/ (excluding the usual suspects like Drupal etc.)? I’m curious as to how they differ from robust consumer-grade systems like EE, Joomla, MODX etc.

Todd


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I worked on a Documentum system and a Sharepoint system when I was at MBC. I was only responsible for creative direction, not implementation. These were massive multi-million dollar projects, and neither one ended up looking very nice, or being user-friendly. Sharepoint needs to be buried in a peat bog and dug up after N years and used as firelighters.

I played with Magnolia a few years ago, never did anything productive with it, but it was gorgeous to look at inside and out.

One I’m surprised not to see here is Plone. That’s an open-source system written in Python, and enormously popular in Europe. I’ve done one project in it, front to back. I had to learn Python as I went, so my productivity wasn’t very high. The site turned out to look and work very nicely, though. I haven’t touched Python since.

Walter

On Nov 13, 2013, at 12:12 PM, Todd wrote:

Has anyone used any of the ECM listed here http://www.cmscritic.com/dir/enterprise/ (excluding the usual suspects like Drupal etc.)? I’m curious as to how they differ from robust consumer-grade systems like EE, Joomla, MODX etc.

Todd
http://xiiro.com


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I’ve heard of Magnolia (and Plone) many times but know nothing about either.

Just to satisfy my own dork curiosity, can you give a typical use-case scenario where one of these would be needed? Generally how do they differ from a mainstream CMS?

Todd

I worked on a Documentum system and a Sharepoint system when I was at MBC. I was only responsible for creative direction, not implementation. These were massive multi-million dollar projects, and neither one ended up looking very nice, or being user-friendly. Sharepoint needs to be buried in a peat bog and dug up after N years and used as firelighters.

I played with Magnolia a few years ago, never did anything productive with it, but it was gorgeous to look at inside and out.

One I’m surprised not to see here is Plone. That’s an open-source system written in Python, and enormously popular in Europe. I’ve done one project in it, front to back. I had to learn Python as I went, so my productivity wasn’t very high. The site turned out to look and work very nicely, though. I haven’t touched Python since.

Walter

On Nov 13, 2013, at 12:12 PM, Todd wrote:

Has anyone used any of the ECM listed here http://www.cmscritic.com/dir/enterprise/ (excluding the usual suspects like Drupal etc.)? I’m curious as to how they differ from robust consumer-grade systems like EE, Joomla, MODX etc.

Todd
http://xiiro.com


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They tend to be used in situations where you have lots and lots of authors, some sort of workflow where Person X has to approve content before Person Y can even see that it needs approving, then once Person Y approves it, it automatically publishes to the [intranet, extranet, public web, whatever]. Think massively parallel construction, lots of freedom to create very custom rule-sets for who can see what, when. Compared with a more general CMS, you would be looking at a much simpler and smaller (and flatter) team structure in a CMS, maybe even just one author controlling all the content.

Walter

On Nov 13, 2013, at 1:24 PM, Todd wrote:

I’ve heard of Magnolia (and Plone) many times but know nothing about either.

Just to satisfy my own dork curiosity, can you give a typical use-case scenario where one of these would be needed? Generally how do they differ from a mainstream CMS?

Todd
http://xiiro.com

I worked on a Documentum system and a Sharepoint system when I was at MBC. I was only responsible for creative direction, not implementation. These were massive multi-million dollar projects, and neither one ended up looking very nice, or being user-friendly. Sharepoint needs to be buried in a peat bog and dug up after N years and used as firelighters.

I played with Magnolia a few years ago, never did anything productive with it, but it was gorgeous to look at inside and out.

One I’m surprised not to see here is Plone. That’s an open-source system written in Python, and enormously popular in Europe. I’ve done one project in it, front to back. I had to learn Python as I went, so my productivity wasn’t very high. The site turned out to look and work very nicely, though. I haven’t touched Python since.

Walter

On Nov 13, 2013, at 12:12 PM, Todd wrote:

Has anyone used any of the ECM listed here http://www.cmscritic.com/dir/enterprise/ (excluding the usual suspects like Drupal etc.)? I’m curious as to how they differ from robust consumer-grade systems like EE, Joomla, MODX etc.

Todd
http://xiiro.com


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Ah, I see. The first 2 things that came to mind were CNN and the NYT. Ok, I get it. Interesting.

Your comment about Magnolia being “gorgeous” intrigued me so I’m installing it now.

Todd

They tend to be used in situations where you have lots and lots of authors, some sort of workflow where Person X has to approve content before Person Y can even see that it needs approving, then once Person Y approves it, it automatically publishes to the [intranet, extranet, public web, whatever]. Think massively parallel construction, lots of freedom to create very custom rule-sets for who can see what, when. Compared with a more general CMS, you would be looking at a much simpler and smaller (and flatter) team structure in a CMS, maybe even just one author controlling all the content.

Walter

On Nov 13, 2013, at 1:24 PM, Todd wrote:

I’ve heard of Magnolia (and Plone) many times but know nothing about either.

Just to satisfy my own dork curiosity, can you give a typical use-case scenario where one of these would be needed? Generally how do they differ from a mainstream CMS?

Todd
http://xiiro.com

I worked on a Documentum system and a Sharepoint system when I was at MBC. I was only responsible for creative direction, not implementation. These were massive multi-million dollar projects, and neither one ended up looking very nice, or being user-friendly. Sharepoint needs to be buried in a peat bog and dug up after N years and used as firelighters.

I played with Magnolia a few years ago, never did anything productive with it, but it was gorgeous to look at inside and out.

One I’m surprised not to see here is Plone. That’s an open-source system written in Python, and enormously popular in Europe. I’ve done one project in it, front to back. I had to learn Python as I went, so my productivity wasn’t very high. The site turned out to look and work very nicely, though. I haven’t touched Python since.

Walter

On Nov 13, 2013, at 12:12 PM, Todd wrote:

Has anyone used any of the ECM listed here http://www.cmscritic.com/dir/enterprise/ (excluding the usual suspects like Drupal etc.)? I’m curious as to how they differ from robust consumer-grade systems like EE, Joomla, MODX etc.

Todd
http://xiiro.com


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It was one of the first “front-end-editing” interfaces I ever saw. IIRC, you didn’t shift over to a separate interface to edit, you just engaged the edit mode and changed things directly in the rendered layout. This was years and years ago, truly groundbreaking at the time.

Walter

On Nov 13, 2013, at 2:40 PM, Todd wrote:

Ah, I see. The first 2 things that came to mind were CNN and the NYT. Ok, I get it. Interesting.

Your comment about Magnolia being “gorgeous” intrigued me so I’m installing it now.

Todd
http://xiiro.com

They tend to be used in situations where you have lots and lots of authors, some sort of workflow where Person X has to approve content before Person Y can even see that it needs approving, then once Person Y approves it, it automatically publishes to the [intranet, extranet, public web, whatever]. Think massively parallel construction, lots of freedom to create very custom rule-sets for who can see what, when. Compared with a more general CMS, you would be looking at a much simpler and smaller (and flatter) team structure in a CMS, maybe even just one author controlling all the content.

Walter

On Nov 13, 2013, at 1:24 PM, Todd wrote:

I’ve heard of Magnolia (and Plone) many times but know nothing about either.

Just to satisfy my own dork curiosity, can you give a typical use-case scenario where one of these would be needed? Generally how do they differ from a mainstream CMS?

Todd
http://xiiro.com

I worked on a Documentum system and a Sharepoint system when I was at MBC. I was only responsible for creative direction, not implementation. These were massive multi-million dollar projects, and neither one ended up looking very nice, or being user-friendly. Sharepoint needs to be buried in a peat bog and dug up after N years and used as firelighters.

I played with Magnolia a few years ago, never did anything productive with it, but it was gorgeous to look at inside and out.

One I’m surprised not to see here is Plone. That’s an open-source system written in Python, and enormously popular in Europe. I’ve done one project in it, front to back. I had to learn Python as I went, so my productivity wasn’t very high. The site turned out to look and work very nicely, though. I haven’t touched Python since.

Walter

On Nov 13, 2013, at 12:12 PM, Todd wrote:

Has anyone used any of the ECM listed here http://www.cmscritic.com/dir/enterprise/ (excluding the usual suspects like Drupal etc.)? I’m curious as to how they differ from robust consumer-grade systems like EE, Joomla, MODX etc.

Todd
http://xiiro.com


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It appears I have to install JRE from Oracle in order to run Magnolia. Before I do, is there any reason why I shouldn’t install it? I seem to recall some fairly serious Mac/Java security issues (last year?).

Todd


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The issues were that Oracle had released patches to some nasty zero-day bugs, but Apple hadn’t distributed them in any sort of a timely fashion. Apple has since gotten out of the Java distribution business, and they have added some careful code to their system that disables Java entirely if you haven’t used it for a while. It’s safe to use now.

Walter

On Nov 13, 2013, at 4:14 PM, Todd wrote:

It appears I have to install JRE from Oracle in order to run Magnolia. Before I do, is there any reason why I shouldn’t install it? I seem to recall some fairly serious Mac/Java security issues (last year?).

Todd
http://xiiro.com


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Well, from the UI screenshots Magnolia does indeed look very sharp, too bad I can’t install it. I’ve wasted hours with the Java/Terminal bs and I’m no closer to the the bloody setup screen. As nice as it appears only a 40-year-old-propeller-beanie-wearing-virgin-geek-who-still-lives in-his mom’s-basement could enjoy this &%!@.

Todd


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Hey, that cuts awfully close to home!

Actually, maybe Java was easier on the Mac when I tried it – Apple even distributed a few of their Server control apps as Java runtimes, so they were closer to your pain point and made it work.

Walter

On Nov 14, 2013, at 12:34 AM, Todd wrote:

Well, from the UI screenshots Magnolia does indeed look very sharp, too bad I can’t install it. I’ve wasted hours with the Java/Terminal bs and I’m no closer to the the bloody setup screen. As nice as it appears only a 40-year-old-propeller-beanie-wearing-virgin-geek-who-still-lives in-his mom’s-basement could enjoy this &%!@.

Todd
http://xiiro.com


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Java appears to be installed correctly according to Oracle’s online verification tool, that was the easy part. The problem is Magnolia isn’t seeing the installed tools and thus I can’t get past step 1 of the installation. Very annoying. Would it kill them to include an installer with the free version? Only the Enterprise version gets one. Geez.

Todd

Actually, maybe Java was easier on the Mac when I tried it – Apple even distributed a few of their Server control apps as Java runtimes, so they were closer to your pain point and made it work.


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