[Pro] EASIEST and QUICKEST alternative

On 22 Aug 2016, 1:50 pm, TomBliss wrote:

Historian, please google me at either of the two Leeds universities and send me an email.

… why not posting the serial here?

It would spare us many idiots rushing in, commenting in an outrageous and suffering way for an application that they don’t understand anyway!

@historian

You venture calling people “Twat”? What gives you the right doing this? Try behaving adult because you talk to adults.

Cheers

Thomas


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I very much doubt Freeway would have appreciated your diplomatic skills. Alienating honest well-meaning customers is a sure-fire route to failure. I have not read your ‘thousands of posts’ but if they were as arrogant, unsympathetic and wrongheaded as the above, I would hazard that they would have done more damage to the brand than whatever good you believed you were contibuting. But maybe you only recently became a resentful bully.

If so one wonders why, if you have not lost employment here.

If you read our posts properly, instead of shooting your mouth into your foot, you will notice that both Historian and I went to Softpress with our wallets open. As honest customers. We didn’t buy upgrades before because we didn’t need them yet. Would you buy a mandocello? Or hair curlers? Or a spare engine for a 747? I suspect not.

Don’t blame us for Freeway’s failure. I may not be as clever at programming websites as you are, but that does not lay me open to abuse. For all you know I may posess skills that you could only dream of. Not that it would matter one jot.

Your knowledge of the Freeway architecture is utterly irrelevant in this discussion. Freeway was succesful because it appealed to non-coding designers. But then that very USP became a millstone. And no amount of new features was going to develop that saturated market - eroded, I suspect, by wordpress. Sometimes the function of a website is more important than its code. Actually always. Don’t shoot the messenger and don’t expect respect when you behave like a ten-year-old.


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Thomas - “idiots rushing in, commenting in an outrageous and suffering way for an application that they don’t understand anyway!”

No-one said that Freeway customers should understand every nuance of the program to use it. There was no exam to be passed before we were allowed to spend our money on the product.

I bought Freeway 1. It did what I wanted it to do, so I learned how to use it to my advantage, and have continued to do so ever since. This does not make me an idiot. It makes me a customer.

If you don’t understand that, and if this forum has been full of such outrageous, spiteful and brutal attacks on honest people asking for help then I’m not surprised that Freeway died.

You should both be ashamed of yourselves - though I doubt either you have the capacity.

Over and out


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‘thousands of posts’ but if they were as arrogant, unsympathetic and wrongheaded as the above, I would hazard that they would have done more damage to the brand than whatever good you believed you were contibuting. But maybe you only recently became a resentful bully.

2.859 - to be precise. And this one.

Yes - they’re all arrogant and mostly unsympathetic - it’s the pain being an asshole. I stand for it. But they are not wrongheaded, at least most of them!

If you read our posts properly …

If you might read them yourself, you may have recognized that some of them are already from me!

Don’t blame us for Freeway’s failure.

You’re part of - not more not less!

Your knowledge of the Freeway architecture is utterly irrelevant in this discussion. Freeway was succesful because it appealed to non-coding designers. But then that very USP became a millstone. And no amount of new features was going to develop that saturated market - eroded, I suspect, by wordpress. Sometimes the function of a website is more important than its code. Actually always. Don’t shoot the messenger and don’t expect respect when you behave like a ten-year-old.

It’s its content - nothing else. And the way you represent it. Nothing to do with code. Adult enough?

Cheers

Thomas


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“It’s its content - nothing else. And the way you represent it. Nothing to do with code. Adult enough?”

Absolutely, so why dump on people just because they don’t understand all the technical nooks and crannies - most of which they never wanted or needed?

My comments were to The Big E.

We are NOT part of Freeways’s failure. It is outrageous that you should even think that. Do you have an old coat you like, perhaps, that maybe you bough in a shop that since went out of business? You blaming me for Softpress going down is the same as me blaming you for the shop closing. I had a product that did what I wanted. I knew I would have to upgrade when I eventually moved to El Capitan, so I when the moment came I came with my money to upgrade. But the door was shut. Not my fault - and it’s is shocking that you and Ernest should ever think it was.

Please go into a quiet corner and think about what you did.


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How do I stop emails from coming in from this the posts.
Chris


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Click on the bottom-most link in the Web view of the mailing list. Locate the list memberships portion of the form, un-check Mail next to the lists where it is checked. Press the Update Memberships button. The mail should stop, although you will be able to post to the list and read replies through the Web interface. I believe (but can’t confirm) that you may also still be able to create new threads by sending a new mail message to the list address, but you just won’t get any updates from it.

Walter

On Aug 22, 2016, at 10:52 PM, Chris Hembree email@hidden wrote:

How do I stop emails from coming in from this the posts.
Chris


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Information for existing FreewayTalk / Groups.io users - Site Feedback - Softpress Talk


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Frankly downright rude comments like these have no place on this forum which until recently had been a very friendly community. If you can’t reply in a polite manner then maybe it is best not to comment at all.

We all use Freeway in our own way and to continue to misrepresent how Freeway can/should be used does nobody any favours. Yes your contributions to this forum have been extremely interesting and very useful but the recent bitter attacks are totally uncalled for. All it achieves is to drive people away from this community and I can’t see how that benefits anyone.

If you don’t have anything positive and polite to say then please don’t press the ‘send’ button. As Thomas said is a previous post, maybe "End of transmission and out!” should have been taken literally.

Gordon


On 22 Aug 2016, at 9:36pm, The Big Erns email@hidden wrote:

So lecture away mister “pity me, give me free stuff”. You and mister “twat” are now in charge f this community.

And in case anyone else is confused, I was never a member of Team Freeway. That was their mistake.

On 22 Aug 2016, at 9:55pm, Thomas Kimmich email@hidden wrote:

It would spare us many idiots rushing in, commenting in an outrageous and suffering way for an application that they don’t understand anyway!


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Is there anywhere I can still get a copy of the last version in the 6.xx series of FWP?

I’ve got a serial - in fact the reason I discovered Softpress had put up the shutters is because I was looking at upgrading to V7, but that’s no longer an option.

I’m not a web designer, my original attraction to FWP was when I was doing a PhD. Being able to create a decent looking site without having to learn code was a major plus point. Not that I couldn’t have learnt code, but the time it would take would be a distraction from other activities.

Very sad news. I had a lot of help from the folks here back in the day and I did once drop into Softpress towers and met the crew. Lovely friendly bunch of people.


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I think the latest version of Freeway Pro 6 was 6.1.2 (Oct 2013);
https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/795566/softpress/downloads/Freeway6Pro612.zip https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/795566/softpress/downloads/Freeway6Pro612.zip
Regards,
Tim.

On 24 Aug 2016, at 09:04, Tacitus email@hidden wrote:

Is there anywhere I can still get a copy of the last version in the 6.xx series of FWP?


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Thanks Tim. I think my original download got lost in the transfer to a new machine.


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I wanted to say that no one has contributed more to these boards than Thomas and Big Erns. (Others have also contributed as much as they have, like Walt, Caleb, etc…). Have they at times expressed a bit of frustration with some of us? Yes. Has it likely been deserved to some degree? I’d also say yes. Has it stung at times at those where it as aimed? Probably.

But writing them off becuase of that isn’t fair to them. Ernie has helped me immensely over the years, as has Thomas and others. I think that probably there are a few holes in Ernie’s wall where he punched his wall after reading my questions to his responses. Or bruises on is head where he pounded it on his desk.

Ernie, I’m sorry for that! But give them a break. They have given an enormous amount and their frustration has, to my mind, been becuase of the split between us WIYIWYG folks and those who saw Freeway as a gateway to greater and better things.

Imagine Walt, who it sounds like didn’t even use Freeway any more spending hours of his time answering questions. Or Ernie who had better things to do with a program he used part of but still gave a hand to those of us downhill from him. Thomas sounds like he used it morel than the other two but certainly didn’t have to contribute all he did. Same for Caleb and… the list is quite long.

Though at times their comments on the board were rebukes, to my mind they were more expressing an opinion and I never really saw it as attacking others.

As I’ve moved on to Sparkle I realize how out of my depth I was with Freeway and the need for actions and coding to get it where they wanted it to be. And I feel a bit bad for wasting their time when their response should have been to go back to the kiddy pool. And they would have been right to do it. Again, “what was Freeway and who was it for” is not a simple or clear question.

So, thanks to Ernie and Thomas, Walt and everyone else. You made things better for us and that’s where we need to leave things as this all winds down. I’m grateful to you all.

Frankly downright rude comments like these have no place on this forum which until recently had been a very friendly community. If you can’t reply in a polite manner then maybe it is best not to comment at all.


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I too have been helped by Thomas in the past, but as someone who moderates a number of web forums, on topics as touchy as traditional music and climate change, I know that it is never reasonable to attack a new arrival who has come to the forum in all innocence looking for help - no matter how misguided they might be.

Many would not even realise that this site was run by Walter and not by Freeway (they used to send people here), and the customer is always right. And even when they are wrong, they must be always treated with respect and patience - as most people here do.

To use one’s superior expertise as a weapon to belittle or insult an innocent enquirer is utterly disgraceful behaviour, and if I was running this site I would have banned both these two, and a maybe couple more regardless of their expertise or track record. It is beyond the pale to talk in those terms, unprompted, on the internet.

I had great sympathy for Historian who did not deserve the bashing he got. Yes his response was intemperate, but that’s what it was: A response.

For every person who stands up for themselves, as I did, there will on average be 5 more who slide away disgusted, never to return, and perhaps 15 more who read but never post, to do likewise.

Given how much tech support costs, companies like Freeway rely heavily on a good community forum like this (and it is good - very good and I’ve expressed my gratitude many times), but if this sort of thing happens then it can only damage the parent company.

I can only assume that our two friends assumed that I was lying about my predicament, (both in terms of the upgrade and the dyslexia) and merely trying to get a free copy of Freeway.

I wasn’t.

They may think their expertise and track record of helping people entitles them to be as rude and unpleasant as they like. Well, plainly they do, as they’ve said as much.

But it doesn’t.

What they forget is that the people they are jumping on might have far greater expertise in some other arena than operating a web authoring package, possibly something actually more important (they do exist, surprisingly), and may even help other people themselves far far more than anyone ever has on this forum.


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Thanks for making the topic come back around to what it should be. Everybody needs to cool down about this, and remember Aesop’s fable of the elephant. We each have our own idea what animal we are all fondling. None of us are wrong, or should be ridiculed for our view.

As to this:

On Aug 24, 2016, at 5:37 PM, TomBliss email@hidden wrote:

Many would not even realise that this site was run by Walter and not by Freeway (they used to send people here),

I built the software that runs this site (with help from Finlay Dobbie, who wrote the security trampoline in C or something like that) and long ago I had root on the box it runs on, but I stopped being involved in the actual administration of it several (many, now that I think about it) years ago. It all grew out of my deep and abiding dissatisfaction with PHPBB and similar, which always (if they did it at all) grudgingly supported e-mail as a client. I built this system to make mail the first-class citizen, and the web “just another subscriber” to the One True Mailing List.

Walter


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Some with long memories will recall an app called Claris Email, which had some stalwart fans but ultimately disappeared. Many users felt desperate at the time, but I’m pretty sure they all moved on sooner or later.

Freeway also has some stalwart supporters, though clearly not enough for Softpress to continue as a viable business and it’s time to move on. None of the alternatives are perfect and neither is Freeway. More importantly it has no future.

My humble suggestion is that everybody keeps an open mind and starts trying some alternatives to see what works best for you all. Arguments, insults or even pouring over ancient history are all pointless. In a couple years time we will all be ex Freeway users.

Ashley


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I remember Claris fondly, and it’s predecessor GreatWorks.

In fact Freeway was much like the Draw functions of these to me. All the innovations which happened inside drop-downs that I never opened were irrelvent to me - I’d already built a big website in, I think FW2, and all I wanted to do was add pages using the methods I understood. I did tussle with Actions for downloads, but the text used to default to Times if you did do some bodging, which annoyed me.

With every upgrade I excited looked for the innovations I wanted - polygons, grads, lines, arrows, but the UI always looked the same. Still does in 7.

I wish Freeway had stuck with the original business plans, to make the best graphics-based authoring package - like Swift Publisher (a very reasonable and good InDesign-type program if you don’t know it) for websites.

Also the ability to have multiple editors for content (Maybe they did that, but if so I never knew).

If they had gone that way they might have fended off Wordpress -because it would surely have been much much better.

But they seemed to be chasing Dreamweaver - which was already huge when they launched, which seemed a bit sideways to me.

Oh, and re the Wordpress discussion above - my biggest problem with WP is not being able to embed iFrames, which I use a lot in FW (mainly for my interactive crowdsourced map - the root of my research and communication work) - otherwise, I’d be rebuilding everything in WP now, for all the problems I have with the horrid clunky themes.

Meanwhile I’m still no near to finding an alternative - never mind a QUICK and EASY one. (As you probably guessed I used that title because I’d read all the other threads here about alternatives and barely understood a word :slight_smile:


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Forget about Freeway, Softpress and what might have been. Choose an alternative and don’t look back.

This reminds me a bit of that old search for “good, cheap and fast” where you can only have two of the three.

If you want it “cheap and fast” WordPress is probably your best option, but you give up some of the design control and there are other downsides. You could find a free theme and probably have 50 pages done by Monday. Whether it’s enjoyable or not depends on the various criteria you set.

In a situation like yours I would start by looking at your existing site, then decide what functionality you need in the foreseeable future. On a 400 page site I’d be prioritising quick and easy with a simple stipulation that it must be mobile friendly.

For “quick and easy” Blocs is looking very attractive. It lacks the outright versatility of Rapidweaver at this stage but they are making fast progress. I cannot comment on other apps.

My only concern is what will allow me to produce a decent looking site that performs well without going stir crazy in the process. It’s just a tool to help you achieve a goal, much like a photographer choosing Nikon or Canon.

They all have weaknesses and you have no control over the way these companies are run so you just have to get stuck in and hope for the best or learn to code by hand. Start downloading trial software and give them a go. Within a few days you’ll know what suits you best.

Ashley


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Drat - my last disappeared into the ether.

I’m drowning in options here.

Does Blocs support iFrames?

I must be able to embed my crowd-sourced map - everything pivots around this research work.

http://www.turnstone.tv/tuf1.html

The whole site all looking dodgy now because 7 has reverted much text to Times (again), and some other stuff has gone west too - like text getting bigger on roll-over (who ever wanted that!?)

Thanks


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I added the words “Blocs iFrame” to Google and it looks like it can be done. Blocs Iframe Tutorial (Youtube Video And Google Maps Embed) - YouTube

Ashley


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Ah. Blocs only give you a 5 day trial!

It will take me weeks to get my head round each of these alternatives - I’m a slow learner, and it will even longer because they are all superficially similar, which makes them even more confusing for someone like me.

The more programs I try the worse it will be, but I’m loosing countless thousands of hours of work in FW - work upon which everything I do depends.

It’s all a bit of a trial, really.


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