[Pro] FWP 7 and macOS 10.13 issue

John, Gordon’s images are the same thing as I posted on our ‘other forum’ thread.

Gordon, I don’t understand your workaround. How would you get a new graphic into your document?


freewaytalk mailing list
email@hidden
Update your subscriptions at:

Gordon, sorry, I was being a bit dim there! I see what you mean. I’ll try that later, thanks.


freewaytalk mailing list
email@hidden
Update your subscriptions at:

Sketched out a graphic item. Went to File>Import Graphic

Before selecting a JPEG file:
https://www.evernote.com/l/AKyMqq23s1dKjr6Zk21srkdguXsTe0h70F0B/image.png

After:
https://www.evernote.com/l/AKxs-npu211MGau2TNzEibWcLSjUSPmhylsB/image.png

The options pane vanishes.


freewaytalk mailing list
email@hidden
Update your subscriptions at:

Paul, exactly the same as others here.


freewaytalk mailing list
email@hidden
Update your subscriptions at:

On 30 Sep 2017, 9:28 am, Iain Mackenzie wrote:

Paul, exactly the same as others here.

My advice is not to let High Sierra near your Freeway machines until we know that an update that addresses this OS has been released. They are still selling Freeway, so I guess there is intent to support it with the new OS.


freewaytalk mailing list
email@hidden
Update your subscriptions at:

Paul, you may be waiting a long time! As I said above, I have submiited numerous BRs on this over the last few months and nothing has been fixed.

We had a similar situation with 10.12 and 10.11 during the beta phase, but the issues were fixed in the public release.

It would be nice to think that Softpress were on the case here, but as we can’t contact them, who knows!


freewaytalk mailing list
email@hidden
Update your subscriptions at:

I have sent an email to them directly about the two issues noted here - not yet had a reply, but it is the weekend.

It’s early days with High Sierra anyway, and received wisdom tells us not to apply the new OS on production machines Day 1 anyway. I’m lucky that I have a “stunt” Mac that I can try it out on without affecting my work, but I know others may not have that facility.

The question here is - which is more important, continuing to work with Freeway, or keeping up with Apple’s releases?

Softpress is still selling Freeway 7 on their site, which implies a commitment to continue supporting it. Time will tell. We’ll know what the position is next week, I guess.

On 30 Sep 2017, 4:56 pm, Iain Mackenzie wrote:

Paul, you may be waiting a long time! As I said above, I have submiited numerous BRs on this over the last few months and nothing has been fixed.

We had a similar situation with 10.12 and 10.11 during the beta phase, but the issues were fixed in the public release.

It would be nice to think that Softpress were on the case here, but as we can’t contact them, who knows!


freewaytalk mailing list
email@hidden
Update your subscriptions at:

Paul, for me it is much more important to keep up with the latest macOS release. I have been using 10.13 for months now on my production iMac, and the only issue I have had is with Freeway.
How have you contacted Softpress? I thought they were not contactable by phone or email.


freewaytalk mailing list
email@hidden
Update your subscriptions at:

Just dropped by to see if anyone was having problems with High Sierra.

For the record Freeway Pro 7.1.4 is behaving nicely with High Sierra! Can import images with no problems.

Hope this is resolved for you all!

Steve


freewaytalk mailing list
email@hidden
Update your subscriptions at:

Hi Paul and others,

The problems with the Import dialog are depressingly familiar. Apple regularly break file dialogs for Carbon programs with every new system. They fixed these problems in a pre-release version of El Capitan, and in a post-release version of Sierra, so my hope is that they will also fix them in a future version of High Sierra. But they will only do this if enough people report problems by filing bugs in their bug reporter. The more bug reports the better, because Apple take more notice of bugs that are widely reported.

These problems won’t occur in Cocoa programs, and they won’t necessarily occur in all Carbon programs. Freeway is using (legitimate) Carbon APIs to add extra controls to the Import dialog, but Carbon programs which use vanilla dialogs probably won’t have the same problems. If you can find other Carbon programs that use extended file dialogs and have similar problems, it would be worth including information about this in bug reports.

I’m not using High Sierra, because I’m following my usual policy of giving Apple time to fix some of their bugs. If Apple don’t fix the file dialog bugs, I can think of ways to rewrite parts of Freeway that are affected. But I don’t know that I would be paid for doing this, so it’s not something that I’m planning to do in a hurry - particularly since Apple might fix the problem in a future update to High Sierra. I have a personal interest in Freeway, since I worked on it for many years, and I also have an ongoing association with Softpress, since they have published my music program (Fretspace) - but I’m no longer employed by Softpress. My plan for Fretspace is to make enough money to fund future development, including a new version of Freeway - which I have started working on, but which is a pretty major task.

As far as the current version of Freeway is concerned, there will come a time when it will no longer run on the latest (future) version of macOS. Apple have said that they will be dropping support for 32-bit applications in a future system and that High Sierra is the last system that will have “full” support for 32-bit apps. Freeway is a 32-bit app because it is a Carbon app. Apple created a 64-bit version of Carbon some years ago, but axed it because they decided - perhaps reasonably from their perspective - that they didn’t want to continue supporting two separate development frameworks (Carbon and Cocoa).

Personally, I think it’s always sensible to delay upgrading to the latest version of macOS until Apple have had time to fix bugs, but it’s not a good idea to get stuck on an old system that is no longer being supported with security updates etc. Apple normally support the current system and the previous system (and maybe the system before that) but they don’t support older systems. One way around this problem, which is popular with developers, is to use virtual systems (VMWare or Parallels) to run older systems - including systems that cannot otherwise be run on the latest hardware.

As to why Apple keep breaking Carbon file dialogs, I think that this is because they decided some years ago that they would rewrite these dialogs so that they call through to Cocoa APIs, and my suspicion is that they used private Cocoa APIs rather than public Cocoa APIs. Third-party developers are warned against using private APIs because they are not stable (in the sense that they could change in future versions of macOS), and any use of private APIs will automatically cause an application to be rejected from the App store. But Apple can use private APIs, because they wrote them and they can test their own software for problems that arise when these APIs are changed. The problem for Carbon is that it is deprecated, so Apple doesn’t devote much resource to testing it.

Jeremy


freewaytalk mailing list
email@hidden
Update your subscriptions at:

Thanks, Jeremy. I installed High Sierra on my MBP to see what the impact will be. The main production machine won’t get the update for a while.

FWIW, Adobe, Wacom and others have yet to issue High Sierra compatibility updates, so Illustrator and Photoshop users may well be high and dry if they update (or buy a new machine).

Clearly, the 64-bit cut off means that looking at setting up a virtual machine is a good idea. I do have my previous MBP, permanently stuck on 10.7.5. Just in case…


freewaytalk mailing list
email@hidden
Update your subscriptions at:

@Jeremy Hughes Yes, the last 2 or 3 versions of OSX/macOS have had these issues, but they have been resolved in the public release. Not this time!

Also, wrt BRs, I have BRed this till I am blue in the face (almost!) over the last few months, and all I have received is a ‘Duplicate will be closed’ response, as well 'as ‘This issue has been fixed’. Needless to say, I was quick to point out that it has not!

Now, what I don’t understand here, is why most people are reporting having this issue, but some are not experiencing it. Why would that beI if Apple have tinkered with the Carbon file dialogues (again!), then you would expect everyone to have the issue.


freewaytalk mailing list
email@hidden
Update your subscriptions at:

Hi Iain,

On 2 Oct 2017, at 17:35, Iain Mackenzie email@hidden wrote:

@Jeremy Hughes Yes, the last 2 or 3 versions of OSX/macOS have had these issues, but they have been resolved in the public release. Not this time!

Not last time either. The problems in Sierra weren’t fixed until 10.12.12, as you reported in a previous message to this list (13 Dec 2016):

“OK guys, now that 10.12.2 has been released, hopefully you will all be happy that the issues we have talked about, here and elsewhere, have all disappeared!”

Also, wrt BRs, I have BRed this till I am blue in the face (almost!) over the last few months, and all I have received is a ‘Duplicate will be closed’ response, as well 'as ‘This issue has been fixed’. Needless to say, I was quick to point out that it has not!

Thanks for doing this. It doesn’t matter if a bug report is marked as a duplicate, because Apple keep track of how many times a bug has been reported and use that information to decide which bugs they should prioritise. It’s certainly helpful if you point out that a bug hasn’t been fixed when they claim that it has.

Jeremy


freewaytalk mailing list
email@hidden
Update your subscriptions at:

Hi Jeremy,

Thanks for that. My memory is clearly fading fast. I was sure it was fixed in the first release!

Why do you think some people are not seeing this issue?


freewaytalk mailing list
email@hidden
Update your subscriptions at:

Hi Iain,

On 2 Oct 2017, at 18:05, Iain Mackenzie email@hidden wrote:

Why do you think some people are not seeing this issue?

I don’t know. Maybe there is a hardware difference (graphics processor?) or some other difference in how their system is configured.

Jeremy


freewaytalk mailing list
email@hidden
Update your subscriptions at:

Just been testing the freeway and 10.13 and its working fine, even the import, so I am assuming its a hardware as well as software related issue and I have a configuration that is not effected.
just for the record this is not a retina mac, so has any one checked to see if that the problem?

max


freewaytalk mailing list
email@hidden
Update your subscriptions at:

max, that’s quite possible. I have a late 2015 27" retina iMac. What about others with the issue?


freewaytalk mailing list
email@hidden
Update your subscriptions at:

I don’t have this issue, and I’m running a base model late 2013 rMBP. Graphics are Intel Iris 1536 MB.


freewaytalk mailing list
email@hidden
Update your subscriptions at:

Just to be clear: most people are running the latest upgrades of Sierra with the latest Freeway without issues?

Greg LeRoy

Address for Mail:
Box 540381
Houston, TX 77254 USA

Address for Packages:
1302 Waugh Dr#132
Houston, TX 77019 USA

www.houstonapt.com
email@hidden
Cell: 713-320-3090
VM: 713-526-3050
Fax: 713-521-0333

On Oct 3, 2017, at 12:27 PM, Caleb Grove email@hidden wrote:

I don’t have this issue, and I’m running a base model late 2013 rMBP. Graphics are Intel Iris 1536 MB.


freewaytalk mailing list
email@hidden
Update your subscriptions at:
https://freewaytalk.softpress.com/person/options


freewaytalk mailing list
email@hidden
Update your subscriptions at:

Mine is a retina Mac and I seem to recall that last year’s issue also related to them. Do they use different graphics cards or drivers? I’ve got a Radeon Pro 580.

All the best

Gordon
http://www.gordonlow.net/



freewaytalk mailing list
email@hidden
Update your subscriptions at: