…“Creating working prototypes and gorgeous production-level websites in Freeway is simple. Just draw your content on the page like you would in your favorite image editing or page layout application, and Freeway will automatically turn it into clean, standards-based, and semantic markup that works perfectly across all browsers and platforms.”
No, it is not simple. It was simple, with 4 and 5 and 6.
But to create working responsive layout with Freeway 7 seems to have so many challenges and difficulties it feels I have to start learning Freeway again from scratch.
Ok, that was the moaning. I just had to let go off some steam. Now the practical part:
I thought perhaps following a tutorial could help me on the way to Knowledge Heaven. There is one in the Extended Reference for Freeway 7, but it is not very comprehensive. However, it is referred to “a much more in-depth tutorial in the Appendices section”, but I just can’t find this anywhere. Can someone please point me in the right direction?
If you want an easy way to create responsive websites then you should definitely check out Backdraft. Even I found it simple to use. http://getbackdraft.com
And thank you for that, but been there done that. I may try again, but it is too much of a template thing. I feel I will get more from a tutorial guide line.
So Softpress, please tell me where to find the in-depth tutorial.
The tutorial they refer to starts on page 225 of the Freeway Reference dated June 2014.
However when i went through it last year there were some errors mainly on page 228, that they said they were going to fix, but i am not sure they have yet, i haven’t checked.
Please also note that at the end of the 1st para on page 229 there is a reference to adding the Auto Clearfix action, this reference should be much earlier in the process and if i were you i would do this much earlier in the tutorial.
You could take a look at Webydo, a pixelprecise workaround with many options to make a responsive version of your site. In a way that Freeway offers but with a bunch of tuts. Something I think Softpress is letting us down with.
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On Thu, Feb 26, 2015 at 2:50 PM, Jon H email@hidden wrote:
Hello Noel,
And thank you for that, but been there done that. I may try again, but it is too much of a template thing. I feel I will get more from a tutorial guide line.
So Softpress, please tell me where to find the in-depth tutorial.
I suppose I was a bit too optimistic, John. I saw that tutorial but noticed it was made for FW6, concluding it was an old and outdated version, so I didn’t pay too much attention. I’ll look into it.
And Andries, thank you for the tip.
I really miss an alphabetic index in the references and guides.
No, it is not simple. It was simple, with 4 and 5 and 6.
But to create working responsive layout with Freeway 7 seems to have so many challenges and difficulties it feels I have to start learning Freeway again from scratch.
Your frustration is reasonable. During all those years (I started pretty similar with 3.5) we’d been able to drop and drag items without any doubts.
And now? All of a sudden, technology went further, not asking if this is an acceptable situation or not.
Quick question:
Did you ever stumble upon an expression which sounded like “BoxModel”? I know - it’s a Freeway specific one (and even wrong literally).
Technology went on all these years, not really ‘suddenly’.
It seems that people wanted a feature without knowing what to expect. Box-model-layout or Inline-layout has been out there for quite some time, Dan Jasker thought me how to master this by his series of splendid video tutorials is still hold close to my chest. This was years and years ago, they’re still valid.
People (Freeway users) got stuck. Knowing responsiveness would become a hot item, wanting Freeway to be able to handle that, not expecting to have to actually read a manual.
That’s really all … learn to manage or rather work with inline layout. It ain’t hard, and when using percentages and relative widths … your responsive. Practice. Practice and fail a lot.
Thomas is correct, you will want to look at “box-model” or “inflow”
construction… which we’ve also done with the earlier versions. It’s a bit
unconventional, but it sets your layout up to be flexible-- which is the
first step to becoming truly responsive. This different style of layout is
not only supported in Freeway 7, but can be leveraged nicely with its
responsive tools.
Thomas, can you point Jon to some of your videos on the subject?
„Responsive web design
Create websites that respond and adapt to any device they’re viewed on. Whether it’s a phone or a desktop computer, your sites will look exactly as you designed them to – and all in the same way that you create sites in Freeway right now.“
We all know, that trying to create a responsive website „ … in the same way that you create sites in Freeway right now“ you will fail.
I’m building websites with Freeway since 2006 by drag & drop. WYSIWYG was the reason I bought this application and I was very satisfied with that.
Then I bought Freeway7, hoping to build responsive sites „ … in the same way …“.
Great disappointment.
As someone who never built a web site, I didn’t know where to start but I knew that I didn’t want to make a large investment in software in case I couldn’t pull it off? I found FW EX doing a search for Mac software.
My first site would not be my own but something for my spouse, she had tried for weeks using godaddy site builder and was spending hours on the phone trying to make it work and understand the language. Years ago I had used quark and thought that had to like building a page for books or newspapers.
As my first client she new how she wanted it to look and took some of what she had on godaddy and applied to a template that look similar to what she had on gd. I tried a few templates but never got what she was wanting so I decided to try a blank canvas. Also I need to slow down and think and use the resources that Freeway was offering knowledge, video and talk. By using them all and getting info from people I was able to build my first ever-responsive web site. I’m still trying to learn the language of web designers and some of the code they use but I do feel that I can now start to build a few sites for myself.
Is http://plumsandhoney.com the best site ever built? I’m sure it is not but it made my wife happy. And you can view it on all apple products, not sure about PC because I have never owned one. Is it working on all browsers? I don’t know I only have three.
For me Freeway Pro 7 has been great, yes there is a learning curve but by using the Freeway community and everything it has to offer including actions that simplify the work and the response from people on freewaytalk has been great.
I remember about twenty-five years ago when the university I was with decided to go digital and started using scanners and photoshop, I thought I would never get it down and I must admit I’m still learning photoshop but the curve is getting flatter. Will I ever learn the code? I’m sure if I want a new bell or whistle it my have to happen at least in some limited form but Freeway and all the people who have the knowledge to build the program and actions are the backbone of my education with FW.
We all know, that trying to create a responsive website „ … in the same way that you create sites in Freeway right now" you will fail.
I can’t judge this and I just can recommend not doing so, at least not before trying it. So I did although I haven’t touched absolute positioning for years.
I’m building websites with Freeway since 2006 by drag & drop. WYSIWYG was the reason I bought this application and I was very satisfied with that.
Although I’m doing inflow-constructions, I still do WYSIWYG. I adopted BoxModel somewhere in 2008 - not for responsive reasons. Drop’n drag ever had its downsides - and ever will.
Softpress did an amazing job over all those years. FW7 is a step into progressive enhancement. This process requires an audience, willed to develop themselves further. Softpress is furthermore not known for promoting things, they can’t stand later.
Parts of this audience started to do responsive projects in 2012 using FW5.5. All we have now is a result of all those blood and tears (perhaps). And all I know I wrapped in screencasts. But they’re paid and therefor not part of active advertising.
Back to main:
The following (two) screencasts are the way I’d start if knowing nothing. The “blue, red, green box approach” is my start for all and everything - whether if it’s HTML, CSS or even JavaScript. If the “blue box” works, chances increase for getting the green and red running as well.
On 28 Feb 2015, 11:43 am, Bootsie wrote:
I’m building websites with Freeway since 2006 by drag & drop. WYSIWYG was the reason I bought this application and I was very satisfied with that. Then I bought Freeway7, hoping to build responsive sites „ … in the same way …". Great disappointment.
Great example of 'wanting a feature but not knowing anything about it works in the first place. I see a lot of users here experiencing Freeway the same like they’re riding along on a horse while facing backwards. It reminds me of an old employer of mine, years ago, still running an OS 8/Postscript environment because hey, it works, so why (keep up with) change, right? This was 2003.
All of the sudden he had to catch up, so I finally got to update the studio/workflow. He couldn’t mock more than he hid then. How couldn’t ‘they’ even make this stuff backwards compatible, this is too much all at once, too difficult, etc …
If he only had kept up with development … the changes and challenges wouldn’t even have been there.
For those dragging & dropping stuff iWeb style … yes, Freeway can handle that. But don’t expect to be playing up there in Major league just because you wear the shirt. Practice. Practice. Practice. Box-model-layout or inline layout (…) ain’t that hard. But you will have to learn. I even don’t think that will take you longer than one day. It’s getting out of the habit of drag & drop layout that’s the hard(er) part.
You’re right Richard but… Softpress should mention that on their site. They pretend if everything is easy or is as easy as before. And it isn’t. “No need to learn code… Just drag and drop… Everything will show up.online as you have meant it”. Thats not reality. There’s a great lack.of tuts from Softpress. Take a look at Muse… Webydo… every step well explained in text and/or video. If Freewaytalk wasn’t such s great community with great help from people like Walter, Dave, Max, Ernie, Thomas etc and you, Softpress would have a big problem in my opinion. These days there are better software solutions around for starters to get into responsive webdesign.
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On Tue, Mar 3, 2015 at 8:56 AM, Richard van Heukelum email@hidden wrote:
On 28 Feb 2015, 11:43 am, Bootsie wrote:
I’m building websites with Freeway since 2006 by drag & drop. WYSIWYG was the reason I bought this application and I was very satisfied with that. Then I bought Freeway7, hoping to build responsive sites „ … in the same way …". Great disappointment.
Great example of 'wanting a feature but not knowing anything about it works in the first place. I see a lot of users here experiencing Freeway the same like they’re riding along on a horse while facing backwards. It reminds me of an old employer of mine, years ago, still running an OS 8/Postscript environment because hey, it works, so why (keep up with) change, right? This was 2003.
All of the sudden he had to catch up, so I finally got to update the studio/workflow. He couldn’t mock more than he hid then. How couldn’t ‘they’ even make this stuff backwards compatible, this is too much all at once, too difficult, etc …
If he only had kept up with development … the changes and challenges wouldn’t even have been there.
For those dragging & dropping stuff iWeb style … yes, Freeway can handle that. But don’t expect to be playing up there in Major league just because you wear the shirt. Practice. Practice. Practice. Box-model-layout or inline layout (…) ain’t that hard. But you will have to learn. I even don’t think that will take you longer than one day. It’s getting out of the habit of drag & drop layout that’s the hard(er) part.
Do you expect them for free or is paid acceptable, too? I mean both tools you mentioned take monthly fees (Muse 200€/year - an entire life, cause once touched - never stop and Webydo nearly the same). What kind of tutorials? Video - Books - Skype conferences - personal visits?
If Freewaytalk wasn’t such s great community with great help from people like Walter, Dave, Max, Ernie, Thomas etc and you, Softpress would have a big problem in my opinion.
Ever wondered, where those guys got there infos from? I doubt that one of them has been born with the golden spoon in mouth.
